Hair algae outbreak.

[fatoldsun]

Well, the dreaded hair algae has popped up. Fought I'd see if anyone has suggestions to offer. I amped up PWCs (making a new batch of SW now) and dropped feelings to every other day. As for the particulars. I tested today:
Phosphate 0.01 (Hanna meter)
Alk 7.17 dkh
Mg 1400
Ca 400
pH 8.3
sg 1.026
Nitrate 0.0

I'm running bio pellets in lieu of GFO and I'm into month 3+ months or so so nothing new there. Lighting is a coralife HQI fixture. 2 new Phoenix 14k bulbs on 1/1. Actinics are a big older. Also the tanks in a "sunroom" do lights out isn't an option and there's lots of natural daylight... Thoughts?

 

[MadReefer]

I have been dosing vinegar and peroxide and have seen some relief. I dose 1ml per 10g water of both daily, 8ml peroxide and 30ml vinegar.Good luck.

 

[greybolt03]

I had a bad out break of both HA & red slime started dosing peroxide it helped the hair alge slightly but not enough ever since I added the sump/ fuge and new oversized skimmer it's almost all but disappeared.... What size tank/ sump and skimmer are you running? I also changed from t-5 to LEDs not sure if that has helped some either...

 

[MadReefer]

I also dose Kent Tech M.

 

[fatoldsun]

I have been dosing vinegar and peroxide and have seen some relief. I dose 1ml per 10g water of both daily, 8ml peroxide and 30ml vinegar.Good luck.

Just regular old hydrogen peroxide? And I'd it's 1ml to 10g how did you end up at 8ml peroxide vs 30 ml vinegar? I dose about 10 ml vinegar and have for about 4 months to offset high pH from the Kalk. I wonder if I should amp that up or start just trying peroxide to see if that helps...

I had a bad out break of both HA & red slime started dosing peroxide it helped the hair alge slightly but not enough ever since I added the sump/ fuge and new oversized skimmer it's almost all but disappeared.... What size tank/ sump and skimmer are you running? I also changed from t-5 to LEDs not sure if that has helped some either...

I have a 90 display with a 40 sump holding about 32-33g. Skimmer is a my weak link. A bubble magus 6A which could be more efficient.

 

[MadReefer]

If you feel your skimmer is weak I would not add peroxide. I would also slowly increase the vinegar as it could cause a cyano outbreak. I speak from experience on these 2 points. Your best bet might be to get a few gallons of Kent Tech M and dose that. People on this forum and others have had great success with it in eliminating HA. If you want to talk further on my experience let me know and I will PM you my cell.

If you checkout Reefkeeping or RC there is info about vinegar dosing.

 

[downbeach]

What kit are you using to check your nitrates with?

 

[fatoldsun]

If you feel your skimmer is weak I would not add peroxide. I would also slowly increase the vinegar as it could cause a cyano outbreak. I speak from experience on these 2 points. Your best bet might be to get a few gallons of Kent Tech M and dose that. People on this forum and others have had great success with it in eliminating HA. If you want to talk further on my experience let me know and I will PM you my cell.

If you checkout Reefkeeping or RC there is info about vinegar dosing.

Thanks – yeah, I’ve read fair amount about carbon dosing in general (most on or linked from RC) – my method’s not too scientific. I’m at about 1/2 or less than needed for my volume and I was doing it mostly to help with high pH from kalk. I bought a chweap bottle of vodka (not dosing the good stuff) but for now I’m sticking with vinegar for the pH buffering. I thought the TechM was use for bryopsis (from memory) – maybe I’ll try that. My Mg could be a little higher anyway. The tank actually seemed a tad better today and the tank smelled last night which I think may have been from the bio-pellets – I think increasing that finally kicked in and I thought that might help with the nutrients – everything you read always says to find the cause before you eliminate the result so I was hoping to find a reading from the testing to be out of whack – I’m gonna give it a could more days and another water change or two before I add the next thing. I’m trying to be really careful and change things slowly and one at a time.

What kit are you using to check your nitrates with?

API - so yes, I know the next gradient is 5ppm and that leaves a large margin for error. I meant to order a new salifert test but forgot to add it to the last BRS order. The last time I looked – I went to 3 different LFSs and they either were out of in once case it only had 3 months left before the expiration. Too much cash for such a short window. I hope I'm getting close enough with the API b/c is BRIGHT yellow and that seems to be the baseline - it's doesn't change a bit so hopefully no change is a good indication of 0ppm

 

[downbeach]

API - so yes, I know the next gradient is 5ppm and that leaves a large margin for error. I meant to order a new salifert test but forgot to add it to the last BRS order. The last time I looked – I went to 3 different LFSs and they either were out of in once case it only had 3 months left before the expiration. Too much cash for such a short window. I hope I'm getting close enough with the API b/c is BRIGHT yellow and that seems to be the baseline - it's doesn't change a bit so hopefully no change is a good indication of 0ppm

It has to be getting its nourishment somewhere, so I'd at least be suspicious of the kit. Also, keep in mind that the HA is utilizing whatever nutrients are available, and lowering your readings. You might try the newer Red Sea kits, I started to use them after a pretty thorough comparison with Salifert, since I had a hard time reading the Salifert colors in that small amount of water they use in that particular test. What is your WC schedule like?

 

[fatoldsun]

It has to be getting its nourishment somewhere, so I'd at least be suspicious of the kit. Also, keep in mind that the HA is utilizing whatever nutrients are available, and lowering your readings. You might try the newer Red Sea kits, I started to use them after a pretty thorough comparison with Salifert, since I had a hard time reading the Salifert colors in that small amount of water they use in that particular test. What is your WC schedule like?

Normal schedule is 15g (10-15%) every other week. I'm ramping that up now for at least the next few weeks to go every week.
I have the red sea for reef (Mg,Ca, Alk) and I like them but nothing is quite like a digital reading from a Hanna checker. Anyway I like them and I'd try red sea over salifert.

 

[panmanmatt]

What types of foods are you using? If feeding frozen, are you rinsing the foods in Ro water before feeding it to the fish?

Have you tested your new change water for nitrates and/or phosphates? Just because you are getting a 0 nitrate reading in the tank doesn't mean they aren't the cause. The HA could be consuming it before you can test for it.

Also do you run a CA reactor?

 

[fatoldsun]

Well last night (or rather EARLY this morning) I cleaned the skimmer in and out and gave it a nice vinegar bath. I also cleaned up that section of the sump. Today I'll dust off the phosban150 that's been stored since the bio pellets went online. I also added a common urchin and some more turbos. Didn't notice until I got home but THR hit me up for $10 a turbo. That's gotta be a mistake... I digress. Hopefully I start to see some progress.

 

[Hawkeye]

Maybe THR are penguins fans....got mad at your avatar....HAHAHAHAH!

 

[TanksNStuff]

If that's true... they're gonna charge him $50 each next time after last nights game!

 

[fatoldsun]

Maybe THR are penguins fans....got mad at your avatar....HAHAHAHAH!

Well after last night it'd almost be worth getting shafted but $30 for 3 snails seems harsh. And the nitrate test I got had leaked and has to go back so not a redletter trip to the reef

 

[downbeach]

Well after last night it'd almost be worth getting shafted but $30 for 3 snails seems harsh. And the nitrate test I got had leaked and has to go back so not a redletter trip to the reef

If its a Red Sea Nitrate kit, I have a new refill, if that will help until they can make good on the one that leaked.

 

[fatoldsun]

Thanks Jim. It is red sea but I don't want any problems for the return so I'm leaving everything unused. Hopefully I'll swap it at lunch today and be able to test tonight

 

[fatoldsun]

THR took care the bad Red Sea nitrate test kit (and for anyone who read my TOTT thread, they credited me back for $8x3 for the 3 turbo snails they charged 9.99 for. Check your receipts boys and girls...
I digress. So now I'm kind of confused. I tested the tank and as was suggested, nitrates and phosphates both tested zero. But that begs the question / is it b/c they're absent or being consumed by the HA??? So I checked the basement (NSW) drum. AhhHaa!! Phosphate was 0.08 and Nitrate was 0.025. So could that be enough. Could my water changes be making the HA outbreak worse? TDS on my RO/Di output is zero input I think is 70-80. I never look too carefully. Just make sure it's reading something. Can I test RO/Di water for phosphate or nitrate or will the fresh water need a non-salt test? Other thought, I like having NSW in a pinch so after every WC I make more and add it to the drum (usually 15g new added to 5-10g residual in the bucket). Also I leave a hose (clear plastic like used to plumb the tank) on the mixing pump/powerhead. Just faster to fill my buckets for WCs and it's thoroughly mixed. Could the plastic be leaching any phosphates?

Weird also, my Alk was WAY outta whack. Tank (w/a Hanna checker, repeated to validate) was 171 on the checker which calculates to 9.58 dkh. New SW was 6.50. Where's that coming from? How dangerous is it. Is twice cooked baking soda the answer? Could high Alk fuel the HA? Or have anything to do with it?

 

[downbeach]

If there weren't any nutrients there, you wouldn't have any HA, so yes it is utilizing what is available. It can survive on very small amounts, and you have an added issue with the amount of light in the right spectrum (natural day light) for it to grow.
Like you, I keep make up water ready all the time. I have a 32 Gal Brute with about 25 Gal. in it that is always mixing and aerating. I did have a problem once with a small Cyano outbreak, and started to do more frequent water changes. After a couple of weeks of showing little to no improvement, and buying a better test kit and meter, I found my make up water with low levels of NO3 and PO4. At first I thought it might have been my salt mix, but after cleaning the can and making up a new batch, I realized that it was just a dirty can. So, now I know to clean it about every other month. I've also noticed that while mixing the make up water seems to drop in dKH, so I always add a little buffer to bring it back up. I keep my Alk a little closer to NSW, but your reading @ 9.58dKH, is within acceptable limits.
So, I think when someone is having issues with any of the so called nuisance algae, it would be prudent to start at the beginning, starting with checking both your RO/DI and make up water, needless to say using a decent test kit/meter. How is your skimmer working? Obviously eliminating the DOC's before they can be broken down into PO4 and NO3 will go a long way in helping to solve your problem.
Are you inoculating your tank? i.e. adding any type of bacteria like BioDigest or Microbacter7?

 

[panmanmatt]

I would suggest making up a small batch of new SW in a separate bucket and test that. If there are nitrates and phosphates present hen more than likely it is coming form your salt mix. If the tests read 0, then it could be coming from the larger container you are mixing your water in.

And yes, those readings are high enough to fuel HA.