Phosphate Still High

[NEWSALT]

I posted this on the Spectrapure forum on RC, but no reply yet:

I just spent close to $200 with Spectrapure and purchased a new membrane, MaxCap cartridge and Silica Buster cartridge. Basically starting over with new equipment. I just checked the PO4 in my display tank and it measured 0.12 with a Hanna photometer. I was shocked. I tested the RO/DI water and it measured 0.23! I couldn't believe it, so I checked it again. The second time I got 0.39! Worse! I'm using a PO4 reactor, and the effluent PO4 is 0.03. The PO4 at the outlet of my Ca reactor is 0.04. The TDS at the outlet of the membrane is 017, at the outlet of the MaxCap it is 000.
What's going on? Where is this PO4 coming from? At this rate, I'll never get rid of my Hair Algea. With every water change I'm adding more PO4. What am I doing wrong, or what's wrong with my system? ???

Thanks

 

[Phyl]

How much water have you run through? Is there a "burn in" period? If the TDS is 0, how can you have PO4 to those levels in your water? That just doesn't make much sense to me...

 

[JasonR]

Can you send me a link on the Photometer you are using?
Jason

 

[Phyl]

PA carries the Hanna Meters.

 

[JasonR]

This is the guy to talk to
His name is Bob he is the one that figure out the P04 of the Carbon, He has the HACH meter

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/member.php?s=&action=getinfo&userid=13437

The 0.23 I do not think it would be detcted on the normal meter What is your water comming into the RODI unit?

You should go check someone elses tank out and see what there readings are

 

[Phyl]

Mike, are you letting the water run for a few minutes before taking your sample? What are you collecting your water in for testing?

J, while I'd agree that the .23 might not be detected on normal test kits, that level of PO4 coming out of the RO/DI would be of big concern to me too. When you're trying hard to get your tank down to zero, adding it at those concentrations is just disheartening. Especially when you've just spent all that money banking on 0 at the end! The new (after breakin) unit should be free from PO4.

 

[JasonR]

I posted this on the Spectrapure forum on RC, but no reply yet:

I just spent close to $200 with Spectrapure and purchased a new membrane, MaxCap cartridge and Silica Buster cartridge. Basically starting over with new equipment. I just checked the PO4 in my display tank and it measured 0.12 with a Hanna photometer. I was shocked. I tested the RO/DI water and it measured 0.23! I couldn't believe it, so I checked it again. The second time I got 0.39! Worse! I'm using a PO4 reactor, and the effluent PO4 is 0.03. The PO4 at the outlet of my Ca reactor is 0.04. The TDS at the outlet of the membrane is 017, at the outlet of the MaxCap it is 000.
What's going on? Where is this PO4 coming from? At this rate, I'll never get rid of my Hair Algea. With every water change I'm adding more PO4. What am I doing wrong, or what's wrong with my system? ???

Thanks

At what point are you getting the 23-39?
You said you are getting 0 out of the MaxCap Isn't that the end result product?

 

[Phyl]

He's getting 0 TDS, but a .23 PO4. Seems like an oxymoron unless the TDS meter is poorly calibrated.

 

[JasonR]

I still think he should do a comparison test with someone Else's system
I just think today's Reefers are over Tweeking there systems. The test equipment is so accurate now that people are going crazy with the numbers. Is It good? maybe yes maybe no.

Hair algae
How often do you feed
What is your lighting cycle
How old are the bulbs
When you feed do you wash the food and strain off the water
What kind of food are you feeding
How old is the system
Do you have a good skimmer running
Is there enough flow in the tank
What kind of cleanup crew do you have

I know there is more stuff to consider :
It never ends

 

[Phyl]

True. Even when I had high PO4 in my 180 I didn't have HA. What's the difference? Might be the tang, might be the 200 turbos I throw in at least once a year. I know that when the turbos in my 65 got depleted we ended up with severe HA in there (much harder to keep a CUC in there with my stocking as they snack on turbos).

 

[NEWSALT]

How much water have you run through? Is there a "burn in" period? If the TDS is 0, how can you have PO4 to those levels in your water? That just doesn't make much sense to me...

I agree. Threw me for a loop as well.

Mike, are you letting the water run for a few minutes before taking your sample? What are you collecting your water in for testing?

J, while I'd agree that the .23 might not be detected on normal test kits, that level of PO4 coming out of the RO/DI would be of big concern to me too. When you're trying hard to get your tank down to zero, adding it at those concentrations is just disheartening. Especially when you've just spent all that money banking on 0 at the end! The new (after breakin) unit should be free from PO4.

No, I wasn't letting the water run. I could try that. I'm collecting the water in the vial that comes with the Hanna meter. Thank you Phyl. I feel the same way. Believe me, after all that's spent on this hobby $200 isn't really a big deal. However, I went through this whole water analysis "thing" with Spectrapure only to determine I needed to replace components figuring I was going to get low phosphates and 000 TDS water. Well I'm half way there, but Spectrapure has all of my money.

I got a reply from Spectrapure. They want to send me test bottles to check my water at different points of the RO/DI unit.

 

[radiata]

Newsalt,

I'd be interested in testing my Hach photometer against your Hanna photometer to see how well the results replicate. I'm in Essex and wouldn't mind a run down to Middlesex if the timing allowed me to hit a local LFS or two. Drop me a PM if you'd be interested...

Regards,
Bob

 

[NEWSALT]

Wow. Did what Phyl suggested. I let the water run for about 30 sec. then filled the vial. PO4 of RO/DI = 0.03.

I'd be interested in testing my Hach photometer against your Hanna photometer to see how well the results replicate.

Bob, sounds good. I'll PM you.

Mike

 

[Phyl]

Excellent news, Mike. Glad to hear that straightened out the results for you.

I'd be interested in the test results when you guys are able to get together. Bob, if you happen to be going to the January meeting, I can bring the test kit up and we can test Renee's water

 

[NEWSALT]

Aquarium Water Testing Re: Phosphate Still High

Thank Phyl, thanks for your help.

On another note, I had my water tested by Aquarium Water Testing
http://aquariumwatertesting.com

For $34.99 I did their one-time test. They send you to bottles to send back (in a postage paid box) filled with your tank water. After a few days, they email you the results. I just got mine. The night before, I tested some of the same things they test for to do a comparison. Here are their results with my test in red:

Water Test Summary
Ammonia (NH3-4): 0.006 Good (<0.25 Salifert)
Nitrite (NO2): 0.003 Good (0.10 Salifert)
Nitrate (NO3): 0.3 Good (0.0 Salifert)
Phosphate (PO4): 0.02 Good (0.03 Hanna)
Silica (SiO2-3): 0.8 High
Potassium (K): 232 Low
Calcium (Ca): 305 Low (390 Salifert)
Boron (B): 5.8 Good
Molybdenum (Mo): 0.2 High
Strontium (Sr): 7.8 Good
Magnesium (Mg): 1193 Good (1320 Salifert)
Iodine (I¯): 0.03 Good
Copper (Cu++):0.02 Good
Alkalinity (meq/L):2.31 Low (2.11 Salifert)

Either I don't know how to read the Salifert kits, or they're not that accurate.