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stocking advice

I

Inquisitive

55 gallon tank
approx 88lbs of live rock
2-3 inch sand bed
aqua c remora
2 hydor koralia #2


Finally saw a drop in ammonia when I tested tonight....not 0 yet, so I'm not quite ready for my clean up crew, but it is coming along....as such, I'm thinking about my invert stock list....opinions and/or advice would be appreciated

To start I would add the following:

3- emerald green mythrax crabs
15- red scarlet reef crabs
20- mexican red leg hermits (or blue hermits) is there a difference aside from color?
20- nassarius snails
4- Trochus snails
20- cerith snails
1- fighting conch OR 1 Queen conch
1 - Lawnmower blenny
2- Fire Shrimp

Over time, I would like to add a coral banded shrimp, a few peppermints, a pom pom crab, a porcelean crab, and a blue tuxedo pin cushion urchin....

What do you all think?
 
R

REEFLECTIONS

urchins can be a pain, they like to pick stuff up and deposit the items else where.... some time where you'll nver see them again. and by things i mean frags, crabs, hermits, and snails.... and they eat the corraline algae which i bet you already can't wait to grow
 
C

calaxa

If I had to do it again, I wouldn't do hermits. They are so annoying. They knock my SPS over all the time. They kill off snails all the time. They kill each other all the time. They stop eating the nuisance algae and just develop appetite for the good stuff.

mithrax crabs look so nice in pictures. Check them out before hand in a tank. Not as interesting. I have 2 in a 20G. Never see them and they don't eat any of my algae there.
red scarlet reef crabs - don't have this. You saw this on liveaquaria didn't you?
red leg hermits - these are the best hermits if you must have them. Most "peaceful" of the bunch
blue hermits - a little more aggressive
black (zebra) hermits - nasty suckers. Main killer of my snails and each other. Some will pinch at you when big.
Nass snails - Recommend these. Cleans in the sand but will come out for meat
trochus - these are good...nice and big
cerith - another good one
conch - don't have, no experience
lawnmower blenny - fun guy. can get cranky with time. Likes film algae but may grow to eat hair algae. If you don't have either, he is a bit hard to take prepared algae.
fire shrimp - a bit shyer than regular cleaners. I like them and have two in main display. pairing them makes them come out more.

coral banded - can get mean and eat smaller shrimps (ie peppermints)
peppermints - I'm not liking mine. Devastated my feather dusters. Did not eat my aiptasia. In other tank...killing my guppies. Shy as hell too.....never see them.
pom pom crab - no experience.
porcelain crab - no experience
urchin - don't recommend. Voracious algae appetite. Knocks stuff over like crazy. Hurts if you are not careful.

Are you a member yet (didn't check)? We are having a group buy on inverts in a few weeks. I also need to order from sw.com (cheapest peppermints) next month as I have a big credit with them. Can go in on an order with you if you can wait. If you can't wait, I hear reeftopia is cheap but read the thread on them. Recall some negatives in that thread.
 
I

Inquisitive

thanks for the urchin tip, Reef!


Cal....yes, I did see the scarlet reef crabs on liveaquaria....laughs....well, the drs fosters catalog first...then, I looked them up...supposed to be very peaceful...

I was debating about just staying with the scarlets and the red legs as I want this reef to be as peaceful as possible....will not get zebras, thank you for that tip

I think I'd rather have the coral banded, so I may just forgo the peppermints....espeicially as there is no guarentee that they will eat aptasia

Yes, I'm a member....remember hearing something about the invert group buy....I'm not ready to stock just yet, still have to hit the 0 mark on some of the parameters...but, finally starting to see a drop in ammonia, so I know I'm on the right track....thank you for the offer to go in on an order with sw...I will consider it....am also strongly considering going to Ocean Gallery II when I'm ready as Brian gave me a very very fair price quote on a stock list I emailed him...just am curious about this group buy...never participated in one here or anywhere else
 
C

calaxa

Yeah dfs/liveaquaria doesn't have the most accurate details on the species. They are trying to sell you product after all. Their shipping on live goods is super high too. And it's silly that inverts and fish are considered separate orders. I wanted all those crabs too when I first started. Now I wish I had none. I chuck them into the fuge everytime they annoy me. Guess my son was right (he said no hermits in his tank).
 
C

calaxa

peps are good scavengers. Can keep tank clean if you overfeed. sw sells them 5 for $21 which is cheaper than LFS of $8-$10. If you keep them in their own tank, they are supposedly easy to breed. They have better chance of not being shy and eating aiptasia if:

1) You introduce before any fish
2) You don't feed tank so force them to have appetite for aiptasia.

Note....large aiptasia can kill them. If buying locally, make sure they are peps and not camelbacks. They look similar but camelbacks are NOT reef safe.
 
I

Inquisitive

nods..will keep that in mind....I just have such a mess in the tank now....started this tank cycling with uncured live rock...so I want all the clean up help I can get....hence addign the hermits.....just want to make sure that I'm covering bases with getting a variety, while still trying to go as peaceful as I can....though, I know the coral banded can get a bit aggressive....I just like them, so I suppose that is one concession
 
Hawkeye

Hawkeye

for a 55...

definitely you cannot get a queen conch - way too big.

Now let me mull over the rest of your list.
 
I

Inquisitive

laughs...thank you hawk....*scratches the queen conch off the list and waits for you to get done mullin*



would like to know too if my numbers are right....am I thinking of getting too many or too little of a species?

thanks guys for replying
 
C

calaxa

That all depends on your feeding, algae problems etc. Getting too many, they will starve and die or the hermits will make meals out of the snails. Getting too little, then you have too much algae, etc. Of all the nuisance algae, I think cyano is the worst. Nothing eats cyano. Don't let people tell you otherwise. Once you notice too much nutrients in tank, up the CUC numbers before cyano hits.
 
Hawkeye

Hawkeye

My opinion.

The hawkeye crazy no shrimp no crab list. Why? because I think shrimp and crabs will jump at any opportunity to nip/rip at food from a coral or clam. That's just me. People house these inverts with clams and corals all the time. Anyways...

4- Trochus snails (personally prefer astreas...i still have all of mine from 4 years ago in my 55).
10- cerith snails (i got these and they are apparently the snail shell of choice for hermits. They are great and when you see the zig zag eggs on the glass - it's a neat thing.
1- fighting conch (one is plenty - but if you have a lot of LR covering your sand bed - there may not be enough food).
Functionally speaking - your algae issues (i think) will be resolved with the package above. Add more as you see fit. The conch and cerith snails will help with the sand while looking for algae.

Excellent add-on for eating left over food and stirring the sand:
20- nassarius snails (make sure you get the Nassarius vibex) I don't use tongans and have not seen enough to rate them ok or not personally.

Just for fun Add-ons:
1 -Porcelain crab - (cool looking crab but will require you to dose as it is a strict filter feeder) This is the only crab I will allow on this list.
1- Tuxedo Urchin - if your frags are secure - I see no issue with adding one. They do eat corralline - so best to wait on this purchase until your tank matures.
1 - Lawnmower blenny (supposedly fun fish - but can irritate tridacnid clams by sitting on them).
1 - pom poms are interesting but I guess they are more suited for a nano since I don't know if you will ever see it once you drop it into the 55.

The I wouldn't do it - but a lot of people include list:
Blood Shrimp - expensive and hides because it is a deepwater species. Like all shrimp it may go after food in coral polyps.
Coral Banded - Those claws are not just for show. They can decimate a bristle worm population (good or bad depending on your situation) and have been reported to nip at fish. A mated pair will most likely kill all other shrimp.
Like all crabs - mithrax species - aka emerald crabs are omnivores. That means if you could choose between fish food buffet floating down or fish poop/tough salad - which do you think the crabs will eventually choose? ;) This applies to hermits too.

But if you insist on hermits - make sure they get extra shells (or kiss those ceriths good bye) and please don't go and get 35 of them. Start with like 10 (or better yet 5) and then observe. If you think the tank can handle more - add more later.
 
redfishbluefish

redfishbluefish

Officer Emeritus
Officer Emeritus
REEFLECTIONS said:
cyano, aka red slime, is actually a bacteria no?
Click to expand...

Cyanobacteria, aka red slime, aka blue-green algae is in fact a bacteria...albeit one that gets it energy by photosysthesis. I have a whole bunch if anybody wants some. ;D
 
C

calaxa

Hawk,

You don't like cleaner shrimp? Fire shrimp is just the deepwater version. And expensive? They cost about the same as a skunk cleaner. Sometimes I can get them the same price or cheaper.

Yes all shrimps will steal coral/anemone food. Hermits will do it too. When I used to spot feed my sebae, I would have to give each of my shrimps a big piece of krill or shrimp first. They would force open my palys to grab out the cyclops pellets. They pull stuff off my LPS all the time. Silversides, squid, etc.

Trochus are those huge snails right? They just like astrea turbos that die if they fall upside down?

Inqy,

There's one turbo....think mexican or margarita that can right themselves. Otherwise it's annoying to see your turbos die from falling and not being able to get up.

Also, it doesn't matter how many shells you have. Hermits love killing live snails. To them, why just take a shell when you can get a free meal out of it. For reference, I got 100+ empties on my sandbed. They hardly ever get touched. The hermits will prefer living/moving shells almost every time.
 
Hawkeye

Hawkeye

i know - I prefaced all of that with "Crazy".

Look - everyone in this hobby has hermits and shrimp and crabs.

For me - I don't know if I want any of those in my tank. I may end up changing my mind.

Lysmata amboinensis aka skunk cleaner and Lysmata deblius aka fire/blood are totally cool to watch. Get one because you want it (like a clownfish) but I wouldn't add it to my list next to the clean up crew. I guess we do - just like how cyano is somehow grouped as an algae.
 
C

calaxa

Point taken.

I personally like fire shrimp. Mine never came out till I added the second. The second one didn't know any better and would clean my hand. Still does. The original realized he wasn't getting the good food if he hid so now they come out all the time.

My skunk is shy. Need to get him a friend so he will come out more.
 
I

Inquisitive

hawk....ok...so it seems like less is definitely more....I like shrimps and crabs...so I'm going to put them in the tank..but, I will follow your advice and I will not add 35...grins....I'll do ten....5 scarlet reef and 5 red leg and see how that does with the cleaning....I'll also do the snails in the number that you've suggested....this will save me money and I can always add later if I need more...thanks again for the advice!



am glad I asked you guys before just going out and spending a ton of money and buying critters in too big of a number for the tank....thank you
 
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