Are We ruining the Reef hobby? An article by Dr.Mac

[Trio91]

Check it out, an article by Dr. Mac

Are we ruining the hobby???

I've been a marine aquarium hobbyist since 1965. Actually, we did quite well back then at keeping all types of fish, inverts, anemones, etc. I had many tanks and worked at Marine World in the Chicago area. Tanks were beautiful, basic, and most fish lived well. Myself and friends had all sorts of...

www.reef2reef.com

 

[Wilson]

That was a good read, I agree to an extent. When I go to swaps and shows, and the vendors start telling me all the fancy names, major turn off for me personally. Nuclear Rice Krispies Goldilocks Nugget zoas, check it out..

 

[mnat]

I think an article like this pops up at least once a year if not more, I agree with most of what he is saying but the cynic in me knows this is not going to change.

 

[MadReefer]

I agree with this article, we have gone way too far. I will say anyone crazy enough to spend that kind money is a fool. Unless of course if you're a millionaire.

 

[Jeremy Brito]

Lol so a while back I put a post on here asking are we paying to much for our coral? Now by know means did I have the back ground this guy has or the ability to articulate my topic with as much depth this guy had but the question was the same have we turned the hobby into a rich man's hobby, adding fancy names to common coral and jacking the prices up, labeling things as designer coral when really natural did the designing the vendor was just lucky enough to find it keep it alive and propagate it. The Good doctors goes even deeper in his artical but the subject manner stays on point.

When I posted I was pretty much meet with hostility for even asking, people telling me that the prices are fair because of the work involved and just flat out it is that way because that's how it is.
Now I agree there are alot of variables regarding the sales of coral but at the same time I think every time I look for a piece of equipment or something aquarium related rock, fish, what ever that there is price raise just for adding the word aquatic to the item and sometimes I just stare and go wtf.

For example a rectangular water reservoir made of plastic holds 2 gallons 120 bucks ... its plastic there are no moving parts and it didn't take skilled labor to make but add aquarium to the name and boom 120 dollars... I went to the dollar store found something equal to it ment to hold cereal and made a slight adaptation and works great 3 dollars...

The prices are crazy at times I gotta wonder if some of us budget reefers will still be able to afford the hobby in the coming years or if hopefully the hobby will start to roll back like walmart lol

 

[DEL]

I have always agreed to this. those whom I have gotten corals from before, know that I never ask for a name, I simply say let me get that nice green or orange or purple or whatever color coral. I buy with my eyes. that's why I love going to Feng. he never goes by names. he goes by, "you got cash? then its $25/$30." hahaha. I've been in the hobby over 15 years now, and torches, mushrooms, zoo's, sps, never had the crazy names they do now. in reality, how do you know if what you're buying is really that rare name coral. just my $0.02

 

[Jeremy Brito]

I have always agreed to this. those whom I have gotten corals from before, know that I never ask for a name, I simply say let me get that nice green or orange or purple or whatever color coral. I buy with my eyes. that's why I love going to Feng. he never goes by names. he goes by, "you got cash? then its $25/$30." hahaha. I've been in the hobby over 15 years now, and torches, mushrooms, zoo's, sps, never had the crazy names they do now. in reality, how do you know if what you're buying is really that rare name coral. just my $0.02

Totally I bet if I take a picture of a random zoa in my tank and give it a cool name turn up the blue lighting to make the color pop a bit and list for sale for 60 bucks someone would be like I gotta have that when in actuality it's my least favorite and looks ugly under normal light and grows like a pest

 

[Jeremy Brito]

And those so called designer corals are just lucky finds that haven't been on the market long. The only designer coral I would claim truly designer would be a grafted coral cause those are created an not natural

 

[David@wegetkraken]

 

[David@wegetkraken]

Just a few of the items in my 120 Reef

Aliens Blood Favia
Blue Agave Purple People Eaters
Dragon Soul 2.0 Favia
Golden Dragon Acans
JF Acid Reflux Zoas
Peaches N Cream Bowerbanki Acan
Radioactive Cat Eyes Zoas
Etc...

Marketing gimmick absolutely. Do they jack up the price... possibly. I get the vast majority of my coral through auctions and don't pay anywhere near asking price. That said could the practice fleece a gullible new to the hobbier... likely. The cool names also likely bring more people into the hobby as well and hopefully a few will stick around long enough to actually learn how to take care of their goofy named coral. As far as the cost factor...it certainly ain't a poor man's hobby, but no more expensive than golf, classic car collecting or a ton of others. Cheers and happy reefing!

 

[Jeremy Brito]

Just a few of the items in my 120 Reef

Aliens Blood Favia
Blue Agave Purple People Eaters
Dragon Soul 2.0 Favia
Golden Dragon Acans
JF Acid Reflux Zoas
Peaches N Cream Bowerbanki Acan
Radioactive Cat Eyes Zoas
Etc...

Marketing gimmick absolutely. Do they jack up the price... possibly. I get the vast majority of my coral through auctions and don't pay anywhere near asking price. That said could the practice fleece a gullible new to the hobbier... likely. The cool names also likely bring more people into the hobby as well and hopefully a few will stick around long enough to actually learn how to take care of their goofy named coral. As far as the cost factor...it certainly ain't a poor man's hobby, but no more expensive than golf, classic car collecting or a ton of others. Cheers and happy reefing!

Those last few comparisons in expense are things the average guy struggles to afford lol car collecting if I had enough money to "Collect" cars I wouldn't be working 80 plus hours a week. Anyways I like auctions how ever I vendor who shall not be named that hosts an auction was asked about "reserves" for those not familiar basically the means of setting a no less then price that must be met in order for the auction to be won.. now since the bidder most of the time cant see the reserve price I cant say for sure but let's just say when all was said and done the price finally accepted was about what you'd expect to pay during a average to decent sale. The point being is that not all auctions are bargains if the seller sets the reserves close to their retail prices in fact sometimes the bidders pay more then if they just went to the store to buy the coral. There are means of keeping the hobby cheap and there are expenses in this hobby that come with the challenges of reef keeping but I think the point of the artical was that with gimmicks fancy names and other marketing tactics we eventually set the precedent on higher prices for things that once woulda been cheap and afforable.
I dabble in piloting aircraft it's expensive very expensive and I see it in that too some people have this mind set of aviation as exclusively for the people that can afford it and will snobb out those who say they want to fly but dont have high funds to do it. Sadly that mentality has lead to a global shortage of pilots, and the airlines have been struggling to find a solution.
So when people raise this topic of why things are so expensive I dont scoff at them for asking I encourage them to discuss the facts and think up solutions cause after all I can afford it today but I can be unemployed tomorrow.

 

[David@wegetkraken]

I think that is the beauty of this hobby. I'll easily have $10- $15k or more sunk into my latest build when all is said and done, but if you're frugal you can set up a really nice system for a grand or less. Used equipment, build your own stand, don't buy the designer livestock, etc... Depending on how you define average that still isn't cheap, but with some patience and buying a piece here and there it is attainable. Hey I'd love a Bugatti, but can't afford that either. Like a lot of other things it is all about staying within your personal budget and not falling for fads. I got my 120 for $200 and built the stand for $300 and could have went much cheaper if I'd skipped all the "theming". Lots of budgets for lots of different tastes out there and I still say you can put a system together for just about anyone's budget.

 

[Wilson]

I think that is the beauty of this hobby. I'll easily have $10- $15k or more sunk into my latest build when all is said and done, but if you're frugal you can set up a really nice system for a grand or less. Used equipment, build your own stand, don't buy the designer livestock, etc... Depending on how you define average that still isn't cheap, but with some patience and buying a piece here and there it is attainable. Hey I'd love a Bugatti, but can't afford that either. Like a lot of other things it is all about staying within your personal budget and not falling for fads. I got my 120 for $200 and built the stand for $300 and could have went much cheaper if I'd skipped all the "theming". Lots of budgets for lots of different tastes out there and I still say you can put a system together for just about anyone's budget.

Agreed, when people ask about the hobby, I tell them there are the basic necessities (tank, lights, filtration), and it can get as expensive as you let it. You can go the route of full automation, and spend a whole lot more, or put in some elbow grease, and spend less. Both have proven success, just depends on how far the rabbit hole you're willing to go.

If you want that $1k named coral, it's going to cost you $1k. If you can appreciate and enjoy the $1 coral, it'll be $1. Just what you're comfortable with and where you want to be is what matters..

 

[Jeremy Brito]

Agreed, when people ask about the hobby, I tell them there are the basic necessities (tank, lights, filtration), and it can get as expensive as you let it. You can go the route of full automation, and spend a whole lot more, or put in some elbow grease, and spend less. Both have proven success, just depends on how far the rabbit hole you're willing to go.

If you want that $1k named coral, it's going to cost you $1k. If you can appreciate and enjoy the $1 coral, it'll be $1. Just what you're comfortable with and where you want to be is what matters..

That was a better way of putting it

 

[Humblefish]

Excellent read. This hobby has always been greed-driven, but what we're seeing nowadays borders on ridiculousness. But what bothers me the most is how unscrupulous (most of) the industry has become. Whenever I talk on the phone with a livestock wholesaler or speak with a vendor at MACNA... It feels like I'm dealing with a used car salesman. It doesn't have to be this way. With all the money that flows through this hobby, we should expect/demand higher quality than what we're seeing.

 

[Jeremy Brito]

Excellent read. This hobby has always been greed-driven, but what we're seeing nowadays borders on ridiculousness. But what bothers me the most is how unscrupulous (most of) the industry has become. Whenever I talk on the phone with a livestock wholesaler or speak with a vendor at MACNA... It feels like I'm dealing with a used car salesman. It doesn't have to be this way. With all the money that flows through this hobby, we should expect/demand higher quality than what we're seeing.

Sadly that's the truth for some vendors but there are others that take great care in providing the best take jason fox I watch a video of a lecture he gave at I want to say macma talking about his system and how he goes out on trips and dives with the locals to find the best coral. In the video he shows how the coral he gets goes threw months of monitoring befor it's ready to sell so that he can make sure it survives and has no parasites and that its colors stay quality and if it doesn't he doesntnswll it he also talks about the process of importation and aqua culture and there is alot to it and it takes time and money but theres the difference his corals have a higher price but there not crazy and at the end you know your getting quality not just a name but quality coral. There are so many others out there fly by night or whole sale that just want to produce inventory and get as much as they can.. it's a business I get that but at the same time what's the limit and we're the quality control. Theres a difference between the supply and demand inflation and the super cool name inflation the industry has excepted the later and instead of becoming and industry looking for ways to better provide new frags and quality coral its chasing the rare stuff out of the ocean and tacking a high price tag on it. Eventually at that model it'll be a rich man's hobby and a poor man's fantasy