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Change.org petition

L

LMG1974

I know many of us here are also members on R2R. Lately there has been a lot of controversy going on there and a petition was started by one of the moderators there.

JusThis isn’t being posted to start controversy or division here. But I wanted to share it with anyone that might be interested.

There have been many incidents recently of threads and posts being deleted and members censored or banned on R2R. Even though this has been going on for quite a while, The post that finally pushed it over the edge and started the fallout was when someone started a thread a few weeks ago asking if there were other LGBTQ reefers. It was quickly completely deleted. Many members that questioned the deletion or pointed out similar violations of the Terms of service, the reason that was given for the deletion, have been banned or censored. The OP was simply seeking a sense of community within the hobby. Same as the women in reefing thread that is there. A while ago someone posted an atheist thread that was quickly deleted, even though there is a prayer thread.
Several long term well known members have left, or have been banned, a few sponsors have pulled out, and apparently a few of the moderators have left.

I would simply like to ask if you could please read the petition, especially the update attached to it, and if you agree to please sign it.
Here is the link: Sign the Petition

If anyone wants links to more information feel free to PM me.

Thanks,

Lee
 
L

LMG1974

Foxchase said:
I quit R2R because of this. That and the fact that they blocked Humblefish and deleted hundreds of posts with insane amounts of helpful information from him. The guy who runs R2R is a nutjob and i hope the community can move on to a better page
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I agree 100 percent. The last few weeks have been even worse. I’ve been mostly on Humblefish forum, and here. I really need to be more active here, I’ve been slacking. It’s sad because R2R really is a great forum with good people, and tons of great information. It’s a shame to see what’s happening and rather than making changes or walking things back, they are just digging in deeper and becoming more reactionary.
 
amado

amado

Dal
Staff member
Board of Directors
NJRC Member
I stop posting in r2 reef because I have personally have had post deleted. They protect their sponsors.
You are not allowed to have a bad Expirience with
Apex products. Right away some one from Neptune
Will reply and they will delete the thread.
I had a real problem with my brand new trident.
I posted my problem on r2r and they blame the problem on me. This was a brand new product purchased from bulk reef supply. The product was brand new and it shouldn’t have any problems.

My post was followed up with a call from Neptune help desk. They realized how many Neptune products are associated with my account.
They also noticed that I had Neptune products for a long time. They replaced my trident and r2r deleted
My comment I was really upset you shouldnt delete my post. Neptune fix my problem but the fact was the product still had problems.

As far as the LGBTQ post I believe that your sexuality should never be part of a conversation or post in a forum about reefing.
The same goes with religion or politics shouldnt
Never be part of a conversation in a reefing forum.
 
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M

Miketc17

amado said:
As far as the LGBTQ post I believe that your sexuality should never be part of a conversation or post in a forum about reefing.
The same goes with religion or politics shouldnt
Never be part of a conversation in a reefing forum.
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I couldn’t agree more. I really don’t understand why any of that would be brought into a hobby like this, or any other hobby. It has nothing do with our hobby. We are here for the passion of saltwater fish and coral. That’s the bottom line.
 
L

LMG1974

kabal2 said:
I think I agree with @amado, it should not matter what you are and what you believe in, if you are a reefer you are a reefer period, for me that is how segregation and discrimination starts, when you need a special group for your self and your special needs.
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I also agree. That’s what got a lot of people annoyed, me included. It wasn’t so much that they deleted the LGBTQ thread. Its that they also allow similar types of thread to remain. Such as the prayer thread, women inbreeding, and others. It’s that they apply the terms of service when they choose too. If they allow one they should allow the others, or none at all.
I was “put on moderation” because I asked why they allowed a well known member, that I left unnamed, to use a derogatory term, “Jew the price down”, and only edited it to say negotiate the price down. This was only after people said something. A mod had liked the original post, so they couldn’t say they didn’t see it.
I didn’t originally sign the petition or comment about it on another site for about two weeks. I was just reading and watching. I couldn’t believe the number of examples of unbalanced and arbitrary censorship by the admin. I knew they were rabid about people saying anything negative about a sponsor, but then I saw it was everywhere in every category. It’s not just the LGBTQ thing, that was just what finally started the fall out. They are even watching another site to see who is pushing back against them. It’s crazy.
it was such an easy thing to walk back in the beginning, but the owners response to the initial inquiries about it was basically, I’ll do what I want when I want and it’s too bad if you don’t like it.
you can’t even see who is viewing a thread over their because they don’t want you to know if the owner or mods is on there.
Now we’ll known members have left or been blocked, sponsors have left, even some mods have walked away from them. It was apparently a Mod that started the petition, so it came from inside, and they know a lot more about what’s happening then any of us do.
 
L

LMG1974

I just want to say my intention isn’t to bash R2R in any way, or to pit people’s personal beliefs against each other. I just want to make people aware of the petition and what’s happening and do as they see fit.
 
DangerDave

DangerDave

NJRC Member
I wasn’t aware of this, thanks for pointing it out. Although I don’t know what the official r2r stance is, based on what you wrote I’m sure I do not agree with their viewpoints. But it’s run by a pastor and it’s a private business. I wouldn’t expect anything different these days unfortunately. It’s really unfortunate that they’re messing up what used to be a good resource for information where new folks don’t get attacked for asking a question that internet tough guy feels everyone should already know (for the most part).

I agree with you guys that none of this belongs on a reef hobby site. I don’t understand why politics and culture have to be part of every single conversation, I just wanna talk reef aquariums on a reef aquarium forum. Just do not allow anything not related to reefs.

I’m glad we have this site, I’ve never seen this kind of crap happen here! Yay us!
 
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Foxchase

Foxchase

The post that started it was a post asking if there were other lgbtq reefers out there and where they were from. Nothing negative. The person who runs it is a hardcore christian so he took it down. But allowed other posts about things like that. And then delete a bunch of accounts along with humblefish's account and posts.
 
Foxchase

Foxchase

Not to mention they censored things like "lesbian" and such. The post was named something like "any LGBT reefers out there" and it was removed along with other people who commented or said anything. I know you guys are saying it has nothing to do with reefing. But it has as much to do with reefing as "nj reefers" and "manhattan/queen reefers" or even "car loving reefers" and such like that. The problem is mostly the fact the Reverend (the person who runs it) feels like he has a right to censor everything from people who say even the slightest negative thing against sponsors, to people who want to find other people with similar lifestyles that HE doesn't agree with. Page has been garbage for a while any way so not a big loss
 
M

Miketc17

Foxchase said:
Not to mention they censored things like "lesbian" and such. The post was named something like "any LGBT reefers out there" and it was removed along with other people who commented or said anything. I know you guys are saying it has nothing to do with reefing. But it has as much to do with reefing as "nj reefers" and "manhattan/queen reefers" or even "car loving reefers" and such like that. The problem is mostly the fact the Reverend (the person who runs it) feels like he has a right to censor everything from people who say even the slightest negative thing against sponsors, to people who want to find other people with similar lifestyles that HE doesn't agree with. Page has been garbage for a while any way so not a big loss
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I think you’re missing our point or seriously trying to stretch your point. Your comparisons are ridiculous. I am not here to persuade you otherwise. It’s as simple as this, it’s a private business that they can do whatever they want with. They don’t have to be politically correct, if they don’t want to. If you don’t like it, then stop using it. I don’t understand why people feel (in general) that they can force their beliefs upon others and when in disagreement, they get offended. Everybody has different beliefs and viewpoints. It’s absolutely ridiculous that we are on a saltwater aquarium forum even talking about this. If the Pastor wants to express and stand for his beliefs with his PRIVATE business, let him do so and just stop using the website.


When I’m planning on meeting up with other reefers, it has ZERO difference to me whether you’re heterosexual, homosexual, lesbian or anything else. All I care about is checking out your cool aquarium, fish and coral.
 
Foxchase

Foxchase

I'm not here to argue. And i personally don't care about people's personal preferences. But if we are gonna allow one, thing don't be a hypocrite about another.

And dont delete and block someone who has contributed a TON of information to the hobby that has helped pretty much form the way we treat our fish. That's insane.
 
M

Miketc17

Foxchase said:
I'm not here to argue. And i personally don't care about people's personal preferences. But if we are gonna allow one, thing don't be a hypocrite about another.

And dont delete and block someone who has contributed a TON of information to the hobby that has helped pretty much form the way we treat our fish. That's insane.
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R2R will feel Humble’s absence/ban. I don’t know the circumstances, but wow that man is super intelligent and has provided so much to this community. Crazy
 
Foxchase

Foxchase

Miketc17 said:
R2R will feel Humble’s absence/ban. I don’t know the circumstances, but wow that man is super intelligent and has provided so much to this community. Crazy
Click to expand...
That's what shocked me. Hes literally the person we all turn to when we need help with fish disease. At least he has a forum on his own page wish is full of info
 
DangerDave

DangerDave

NJRC Member
It’s a private business, he does have the right to sensor whatever the hell he wants.

I have the right to turn off my paid membership, which I did today. I hope enough folks feel the same way, and he feels the lost revenue. We can’t force him to stop pushing his agenda on his web forum, but we can stop funding it.
 
P

paintman27

Correct me if I am wrong but, wasn't R2R created because these guys felt they were being bullied and ridiculed over on Reef Central? I have been slapped on the wrist a couple of times via private message from the moderator telling me I was insensitive. I also heard from him when I put up a post about all the problems I had with my Reefbreeder Photon 48"'s
 
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