Houston, we have a few problems

[Mark_C]

Sequala of events:
2-3 weeks ago noticed a resurgence of bryopsis.
10% water change.
Started GFO.
7 days or so ago I noticed that my 2 small anems shrinking, quickly. Got one to the QT, the other I couldn't (can't) find. The QT anem died, assume tank anem is dead.
Immediate 20% water change.
Checked parameters and adjusted for low alk (7.5) and slightly low calcium (380).
Began running bagged carbon in sump.
Another 20% water change Sunday.
Realized that over past 10-12 days a kenya tree, usually very active, has closed up and hasn't opened since.
Over past 5 days a SPS (montipora) went from open and happy to mostly bleached skeleton.
A second montipora has been closed for 3-5 days and is starting to die.
Cleaner shrimp died 2 days ago.
Haven't seen my hyperactive lawnmower blennie in a week, assumed dead.
20% water change tonight and will test magnesium and alk, dosing if required, tomorrow.

Concern 1:
Alkalinity has always been an issue with this tank (see below). I can dose the hell out of it to minimal effect.

Concern 2:
Aside from things dying, no idea what's going on.

Any advice aside from my current procedures?

Thanks all.


And, some info...

Basics:
65g shallow reef
20g sump
2x Maxspect Mazarras
reef octo 110
appx 100 pounds live rock

Current parameters as of 7/22 at 5:30pm:
Ammonia 0 ppm
Nitrite 0 ppm
Nitrate 0 ppm
pH 8.4
Phosphate .22 ppm
Salinity 1.025
Temp 77.8
Alkalinity 109 ppm (6.1dKH)
Calcium 410 ppm
Magnesium 1100 ppm
Checked RODI, all good, 0 ppm dissolved in latest batch of water.

Inhabitants:
Mixed CuC (snails and hermits), SPS, Zoas, LPS, red star, 8 fish (clown, chromis, anthea, bengai, tang, mandarin, chalk bass, wrasse)

Recently running:
GFO reactor (for 2 weeks since bryopsis)
bagged carbon in sump (since assumed death of anem & blennie last week)
10g water change with Red Sea Coral Pro 1x per week (though multiple changes over past week with current problems)

Additional info:
Special Blend (10-15ml) with water changes.
Emptying skimmer every 2-3 days
Frozen food, usually rinse, but not always, feed every 2 days or so
Dosing phyto every 3 days or so 5-8ml
Spot feed corals (coral frenzy) 1x per week

 

[jgraz]

At a first glance the parameters seem good. Yes alk is low but that wouldn't cause these issues. I've had alk go down to the 4's and had no issues short of no growth. Po4 is up there though.22 is pretty high especially if there is a algea consuming it and its still elevated. Its possible the addition of GFO stripped it to quick maybe causing the issues but not likely.

If I was a betting man, and I am, I'd be looking for stray voltage.

 

[redfishbluefish]

.......

Concern 1:
Alkalinity has always been an issue with this tank (see below). I can dose the hell out of it to minimal effect.

......

This concern bothers me. Have someone else test your alk numbers. My thought is that your test kit is off and you've alk-burnt the tank. But just a guess.

 

[downbeach]

What salt mix are you using? What is your SG? What are you using to measure it with? With a reading of 1100 on your Mg, I'm a little suspicious of your SG.

 

[Mark...]

I dont think you are losing fish from the low Alk. Did you rinse GFO before running it?

 

[Mark_C]

KK,

If I was a betting man, and I am, I'd be looking for stray voltage.

That was my initial thought. I even replaced my Aqueon with a Mag last week. BUT! Your reply got me off my ***. I broke out the meter, replaced the batteries, plugged one end into the outlet and dropped the other in the water. I'm running at 9-12 VAC atm. So that seems OK. I may re-test tomorrow under a heavier load to see what happens.

Have someone else test your alk numbers.

When I say I dose the hell out of it I actually mean that it seems to be taking 6-9oz of BRS alkalinity mix every week to maintain an alk between 7 and 8, which, to me, seems a lot. This 6.1 is the lowest I've seen it.
The reading I did at 5pm tonight was with a Hannah meter. I dosed the tank after I made this post and was shooting for an alk of 8. I just did a re-read with the Hannah, which is showing 8.2 now. I followed that up with a Red Sea which gave me 8.3. So that seems to be OK.

What salt mix are you using? What is your SG? What are you using to measure it with?

As above, using Red Sea Coral Pro. I'm running RODI with ion filter, all good, particles at 0ppm. I'm using a Milwaukee reader (the green one) for SG. Reader has fresh batteries and is calibrated for every weekly water change. In a 5g bucket I use 2.625 cups of salt to get between 1.025 and 1.026 SG. Just reverified tank is at 1.025. So, that seems OK.

Did you rinse GFO before running it?

GFO and carbon rinsed thoroughly before adding. GFO is tumbling nicely. So that seems OK.


I bet its that ******* crab somehow!

 

[saltkreep88]

So for your size tank 6-9 oz of alk solution is not that much. Are you only dosing alk once a week?


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[Edwardw771]

How about temp?

 

[Mark_C]

So for your size tank 6-9 oz of alk solution is not that much. Are you only dosing alk once a week?

Yep, once per week. I've forgotten once or twice in the past leading to a 18oz or so dose, but for the most part 6-9 per week is normal.

How about temp?

77.8 atm, I leave the AC on when out and have the tank fanned. Temperature is pretty stable between 77-78, on very hot days it may jump to 80, highest I've ever seen it is 80.1 for a short time.


Is there potential that, for whatever reason, the anems were dying and released toxins which have no effect on parameters? If so, would this have killed only certain SPS, a shrimp, and a blennie? Perhaps a twisted love triangle leading to despair? Could it have been the pizza I gave them last week?
I'm grasping at straws here. Everything seems stable, yet, things are dying. There's no peeling of paint in the stand, no chemicals in the house, no change to the environment. My son knows to stay away from the tank (and couldn't reach high enough to deposit anything in it anyways). ugh.

 

[saltkreep88]

Well there is your issue. 18oz of alk at once in that size tank would kill almost any coral. That dose needs to be divided daily. Corals are must sensitive to alk changes.


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[saltkreep88]

Most*

 

[Raffle King]

It is a Alk Swing you should be dosing small amounts every day or every other day keep your Alk stable and you will be fine

 

[Mark_C]

18oz of alk at once in that size tank would kill almost any coral. That dose needs to be divided daily.

Last time the tank required a large dose was about 2 months ago. It required about 17-18oz and the dose was split over 3-4 days at 4oz or so per day.
I check alk every week when I do water changes. Water is changed in the morning. Alk is checked that evening. If a dose is required, for example - 4oz, I split it, dosing 2oz that night and 2oz the next morning.
This has never been a concern before.
Saying that, I did dose a bit heavy tonight to bring alk up in hopes to help stabilize things a bit.
There was no heavy dosing preceeding this problem.

 

[trivan]

What is the alk on the new salt water? You might be shocking the system if you tank is at 7 alk and then you do the water change with water that is at 9 alk. By the time you test it, it at 8. Not real numbers , but just a theory. I think this is why many people advocate continuous water changes too.

 

[horseplay]

Using BRS calculator 6oz will bump your all by 4dkh. Too high even spread out over 24 hours.

 

[Mark_C]

Lost a hermit today.
So, that's 1 fish, 1 crab, 1 shrimp, 1 softie, 1 SPS, 1 anem (possibly 2) in 2 weeks.

I'm aware I need a doser at some point, but the way I've been dosing recently hasn't altered in over a year and the tank, as a whole, has done very well.
There has been no alteration in any habits and no changes made to procedure in the past few months.
Even if there was an alk spike, or drop, I'm unsure if an alk drop would affect fish and inverts so suddenly.
Another 10g water change tonight along with a superficial sand cleaning and a search for a blennie body (no dice).
Still pondering.

 

[Hawkeye]

i haven't replied as i read this last night and kept thinking if i had any suggestions -but alas i dont. I like to strip things down layer by layer to help get at the root cause. prior to these issues happening, i noted that you had recently added phyto to the tank for the gorg. Did you add phyto before? I doubt that is the problem - but just consider what other things you have done recently that you didn't. Perhaps something will provide a clue.

 

[Mark_C]

Returned from work, no deaths today, some corals appear to be opening up again.
Another 10g WC tomorrow AM, maybe one Sunday PM, and hopefully back on track.
Thanks all for the help and advice. Gives me drive to get off my *** and start addressing alk, probably will go for a doser over next week or 2.
Any more thoughts, please keep them coming. I'm in agreement with Mark at UC that this was probably a dying anem that released in the tank causing some severe short term occurrences and leaving the parameters stayed relatively stable.

 

[Hockeynut]

I would be concerned with the high phosphate that number could and will kill sps. They can't process ALK and cal with phosphate that high. Also get a doser even though it has been working for you every time you dump alk in you are shocking your system. It needs to go in once or even a couple times a day. For stability


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[Mark_C]

Began dosing alk .25oz in am and .25 in pm. Alk steady between 7.5 - 7.8 for past 2 weeks. Ca good. Phosphates down.
I'm guessing the death of the anem had a small ripple effect. I was removing black icor from the skimmer for a week.
Increased lighting and corals thriving.
Thanks all for the suggestions.
All is groovie.
M