I need to learn about calcium reactors.

[PMolan]

I've read pages of material on calcium reactors since I started this thread. I gathered from this that basically Water entering the reactor is mixed with CO2. This creates more acidic water. This acidic water will erode the media in the chamber. Therfore disolving calcium etc.. into the water.
If I can add vinegar(acidic) directly to the tank to control pH, why cant I add acidic water to the tank to do the same thing. I am taking all these comments with great respect, don't get me wrong. I guess adding CO2 directly to the sump may be a bad idea. If I ressurect my seaclone 150, hook up my CO2 to it. Wouldnt the water exiting the skimmer be more acidic, therefore lowering my pH??

Maybe the point that I am misunderstanding is. Water leaving the calcium reactor is or isnt the same as water leaving a CO2 skimmer, -calcium.

 

[PMolan]

Also I am not suggesting letting full blown CO2 into the skimmer. It would normally suck the air, and when the solenoid is turned on, CO2 is injected into that air.

 

[Phyl]

Very interesting questions. I understand better (knowing that your PH is high) your need for reducing the PH. I'm having the opposite problem (8.05 ph) and would love few things more than having it up around 8.2 for a change!

I'd probably be inclined to try it, in your shoes and see what happened. I use a CA reactor (though I'd have to disagree with Carlo's assertion that it adds any measurable Mg into the tank) and by that nature I AM adding CO2 to my sump on an ongoing basis. Yes, that's tempered by going through reactor media, but by the very nature of the fact that the PH is coming out of my reactor around 7... I'm clearly adding CO2 to the water.

As Mladen suggested, you might find a room filled with CO2 as the reactor is "gassing out" what you're trying to put IN! If you fed the CO2 WAY upstream after which it went through a sizeable piece of hose before getting to the skimmer you might find a better absorption rate as the CO2 might have more time to be absorbed before being bubbled around so you might not tend to lose as much.

 

[mladencovic]

...
Maybe the point that I am misunderstanding is. Water leaving the calcium reactor is or isnt the same as water leaving a CO2 skimmer, -calcium.

Well, it isn't but not exactly because of the chemical but rather physical process that affect it it chemical composure:
- water going through skimmer is going fast (large flow) and is highly aerated
- water going through Ca reactor is very slow, maybe even 1,000 times slower flow.

Because of that: CO2 in slow water has time to a) dissolve in the water, b) carbonic acid to react with the media and media only.

When people add vinegar, it instantly dissolves in water, and can instantly "attack" calcium carbonate. It takes time for gaseous CO2 to dissolve in water, and it doesn't have that time when you put it through the skimmer, it will simply leave the water with the rest of the air - think of it this way, adding it to the skimmer is exactly as if you took a one end of a straw in your mouth, submersed the other end in the water and started blowing the bubbles. How much of that CO2 from your lungs, do you think, would stay in that water? Almost nothing.

And by the way, while you might add vinegar to lower the pH of the tank, that is only in extreme case. The problem is that CaCO3 is dissolving to a signficant degree only when pH is much lower from what you would like to have in your tank (otherwise all the rocks in the oceans and seas would have been melted log time ago ). So the people might be adding vinegar only to the Ca reactors. And, actually, that is the whole point that I am trying to make - you are trying to lower the pH only in the reactor, not in the whole tank. True, some of that lower pH will enter the tank after the Ca reactor, but then it will be balanced in the tank by some other methods.

 

[Phyl]

If you fed the CO2 WAY upstream after which it went through a sizeable piece of hose before getting to the skimmer you might find a better absorption rate as the CO2 might have more time to be absorbed before being bubbled around so you might not tend to lose as much.

D'oh. Of course that would only help if it were getting added to the feed WATER, not the air supply of the skimmer. Oh the complication!

 

[PMolan]

So what I am gathering here is that yes this will work but it is extremely inefficient. This discussion is now leading me to believe that the ozone that I am putting into my skimmer isnt doing a hell of a lot.

 

[PMolan]

Well thanks for all of your advice. I proceeded with this experiment very cautiously. When I started with this, I hooked it up to an old skimmer but that didnt work out. Then I took the co2 hose and placed it loosely to the input of the airline to the skimmer. My pH was 8.57 at 7pm. About 9:15 my threshold of 8.40 was reached. Normally the pH would have kept rising until 9pm when the halides go out. My orp actually rose during this process so I would say there was little interaction between the O3 and CO2.

I was watching the tank the entire time. The fish were behaving normally through this process. I had the valve set at 6-8 bubbles per second. Is this a high setting compared to calcium reactors, I have no idea.

Well the aquacontroller is now in charge of this now. I have it set to turn on the co2 at 8.45 and go off at 8.40. This way the co2 should only start to turn on in the late afternoon.

Please comment on this setup. Thanks for all of the suggestions.

 

[Phyl]

I think the instructions on the Ca reactor say to start with 1 bps I'd probably be inclined to drop your bubble count in half (3-4 bps) so that the swings are slower and more controlled. Glad it had the desired effect! Keep us posted.

 

[PMolan]

I readjusted the bubbles for fear of overdosing co2. Im at 3.5 bps (35 in 10sec). The pH is set to 8.35 to 8.30. So after 3hrs of the halides on, the pH is battling to rise. The co2 started at 8.35 and the pH has risin to 8.38 now, the co2 will not go off until 8.30. If I were to guess, the co2 should be on until the lights go out tonight.

 

[Phyl]

Sounds like you have a great plan. If you see it going on and off you would be able to back it down a hair more, I'd think (but I'm not a chemist, nor do I play one on TV )