.Keeping Local Tropical - Mortality Issues

[Whitebird1]

Keeping Local Tropical - Mortality Issues.
I believe that I have a theory on on why attempts that keeping local collected tropical specimens, as well as local indigenous species long term have generally failed. This includes Tropical Fish, Northern Corals and Sponges, Ect.
I need to ask for help and advice from others that have attempted to keep Local specimens. Matt, GregW, Ect!
Also, Links to Past posts will be helpfull!
A Few Pis Of Local Stuff!!

 

[chuck116]

Sorry cant help you but am curious myself..

 

[Whitebird1]

Example collected this fish as juvenile in Shark River, estimated 3 inch's in size, wounded, probably by a small blue fish, commonly know as a Snapper, now it resides in a public aquarium 60+ lb!

 

[Whitebird1]

May be time for this, exspeacaly if imports are banned (Bill HR669)
Very little information on this that I could find, but Thu discussions with others that have the same issues with Local trops, success and failures a pattern seems to happen each time it is attempted.

IN SHORT
Place a local Collected trop or indigenous species in a advanced reef system using Live rock and they seem to perish, as a rule, in a short time.

Do the same using more tradition methods as mechanical filtration, local sand, rocks and even water and they seem to thrive.

It is possible that we are exposing them to the bacteria that we import from the southern hemispheres, Fuji etc, and that that could be the cause of the mortality's experienced?

Possible solution= Start a system using local Live rock or sterilized rock and inoculate with bacteria found in this area, river sediment, beach sand, etc. Lower temperatures could also be a factor. Use our knowledge of cycling, water quality, lighting and this may work!

Just a few thoughts!
GregH

 

[Paul B]

I have collected, bred and raised those seahorses in my reef. I use some NY water along with some local rocks. I also have snails for over two years and some hermit crabs over a year so far. My local NY tank has been running for about 40 years which I put shrimps, snails, fish and anything interesting I collect.

 

[Paul B]

Here are some local NY seahorses, the female is transfering the eggs to the male in my reef.

 

[Whitebird1]

That is cool, what type of food sources and more details on your set up if you can.
GregH

 

[Paul B]

I had those seahorses a long time ago. Here is an article I wrote about them in the Breeders Registry. I also invented and patented the feeder which is shown. Thats when we used to feed seahorses brine shrimp. I raised a few batches of them on only that food.
http://www.breedersregistry.org/Articles/v4_i3_paul_b/paul_b.htm

My reef is a 100 gallon 6' long tank that I set up in 1972. It uses a reverse UG filter and home made lights and skimmer. I collected all the rocks in the Caribbean and Hawaii myself (it used to be legal)
I had a barrier in the tank for those seahorses so I could feed them easier. They had about a foot on one side of the tank where they happily lived out their lives. They are very hard to feed with other reef fish. I collected that pair in New York where they are very common and easy to collect with a long net.

 

[Whitebird1]

im Impressed!
I have abouit a million questions but I would rather cull them down and at a better time, but, what do you think about the bactereal theary? did you treat the wild caughts for parasites? The youing are planktonic feeders how did you overcome that? How did you isolate the youing so that they were not damaged by the filtration and water flow? Just for a start! if you will.
GregH

 

[Paul B]

but, what do you think about the bactereal theary? did you treat the wild caughts for parasites? The youing are planktonic feeders how did you overcome that? How did you isolate the youing so that they were not damaged by the filtration and water flow? Just for a start! if you will.
GregH

I don't know what the bacterial theory is.
I don't have paracite problems in my tank for some reason, so I never treated any wildcaught fish for them.
The babies ate rotifers for a week then new bornbrine shrimp. I grew the shrimp as the horses grew. Brine shrimp can be raised on brewers yeast.
The yound I sucked out with a larger baster looking thing (which I make) and put them in a tank with no filtration, just airation. Every day I would change some of that water with the water in my reef.
I bred and raised them for a few years.
They are very easy to collect from the sea on the south shore of Long Island.
I kept pieces of netting in their tank to give them something to hang on to or pieces of thread with a cork holding them up and a lead sinker on the bottom.
When they got larger I transfered them to a tank that had a HOB filter and one end of the tank was partitioned off with window screen to keep the horses out of the filter.
Out of the hundred or so babies I was only able to get about 20 to adulthood from each spawning. They are a lot of work which is the reason I don't raise them any longer.

 

[Whitebird1]

Place a local Collected trop or indigenous species in a advanced reef system using Live rock and they seem to perish, as a rule, in a short time.

Do the same using more tradition methods as mechanical filtration, local sand, rocks and even water and they seem to thrive.

It is possible that we are exposing them to the bacteria that we import from the southern hemispheres, Fuji etc, and that that could be the cause of the mortality's experienced?

Your thoughts on this?

 

[Paul B]

Do the same using more tradition methods as mechanical filtration, local sand, rocks and even water and they seem to thrive

That is probably true, thats why I run my reef with a portion of local water, rocks and I also collect local bacteria which I add a few times a year.
If you put local fish in a sterile tank like most of them are, I don't think the animal will last long. I don't feel "modern" sterile tanks are healthy even for tropical fish.
I have always said many tanks are too sterile and do not support the proper bacteria. If you never add bacteria from the sea, you are dependant on the bacteria that was in the dealer's tanks, most of those tanks are treated with copper and the bacterial diversity is nill. Bacteria need to be replenished like we replenish our water through changes. Bacteria from the sea will not multiply forever, eventually we will be left with only a few types and those types may not be the most beneficial for our purposes. thats why there are very few old captive tanks.
I believe my tank reached 40 years because of the life I add from the sea.
It is the bacteria in our tanks that impart health not just the trace elements, calcium, pH and so on.
Local fish do not seem to have a problem living in my reef because it is actually part Long Island Sound.