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Tunze or Vortech for 90g w/DSB

T

tgee

I could use some advice on getting better flow in my 90. I don't have much livestock in the tank yet, just a bunch of snails, 2 peppermint shrimp, 1 coral beauty, 2 zoo rocks and 2 frags (a leather, and something else). Eventually, I expect it to be a mixed reef with a little bit of everything. I have a basement sump with a Little Giant return pump that's held back with a gate valve, otherwise the drain can't keep up. The tank is drilled, with the typical mega-flow setup from Oceanic.

I have about 5" of sand and lots of LR arranged more or less like a wall, trying to allow flow around and through it. So far I've tried using various combinations of Koralia 4s, 3s and 2s, but I'm unhappy with the results. I still have dead spots and I really find the Koralia's to be unattractive and obtrusive. I guess it will be a balancing act between having a good amount of flow that blows gunk off the sand without taking the sand with it.

I'm thinking of getting a Tunze package with two 6101 pumps and multicontroller, or two Ecotech Marine Vortech MP40W. Marine Depot has the 6101 marked down, so the Tunze package would be about $872, or two Vortechs for $840. These pumps put out a LOT more flow than I need, but I can dial it back. I don't mind having extra in case I decide to upgrade to a larger tank someday (seems to be the way it goes around here!).

I've read of some issues with the Vortech, but it seems like those issues are being addressed by Ecotech, so I'm not very concerned. I really, REALLY like the in-tank low-profile. My main concern with the Vortech is that it can not be changed directionally. I don't know if I'll be able to have them cranked up enough to get water moving along the front and back and around the rock wall to blow across the sand without creating a storm.

My main concern with the Tunzes is their size. I don't think they're much smaller than the Koralias, but I don't know for sure. I like the fact that flow can be directed more than with the Vortechs.

If anyone has thoughts or experiences with either, I'd love to hear them.

Thanks!
Tom
 
D

Demo

What problems did you hear about the Vortech's? So far the only negative I've read about was the price. I have a mix of Maxi-jet's and a Seiio in my 65 gallon and hate it even though I have pretty good flow. My current plan is to upgrade to 2 Vortech's soon.
 
jimroth

jimroth

Either of those options sounds like overkill for your tank, unless you want a reef crest high energy environment. The sand will go everywhere. You could try one Tunze or Vortech first and see what the flow is like, maybe put it opposite your return.

BTW, EcoTech is coming out with a less-expensive VorTech, the MP20, soon, it's less powerful and a lot cheeper because it lacks the wireless system.
 
D

Demo

Woops, left out a big piece of info. I plan to upgrade to 2 Vortech's soon which can be dialed down(according to the website). They would be overkill for my 65 gallon, but I hope to be upgrading to a much larger system near the end of the year.
 
magic

magic

Officer Emeritus
Officer Emeritus
I have a Vortech on my 46g along with 2 Koralia 1s and a 2 (never enough flow). The Vortech is dialed back to 500gph, no problem with the sand the flow is pretty well dispersed (mounted unit toward the top of tank). If you place it toward the bottom of the tank it will suck up sand. There is a video showing 2 Vortechs creating a standing wave in a tank, pretty impressive. I haven't had any issue with the Vortech other then the initial fine tuning.

Bob
 
T

tgee

Demo:
On RC and elsewhere, I've read of some people saying their Vortechs were noisy, and some had rust issues. The noise issue, while very subjective, could be due to the two parts not being perfectly aligned, from what I've read. Ecotech has recently made some changes to address the rust problem (I don't have the details on front of me - I think they changed something with the magnet). I'm not too concerned about the issues I've read about.

jimroth:
I agree, either is probably overkill for my system, but my thinking is that it gives me more options. I would have one pump mounted on each end, pointed more or less at each other, generally alternating between the two to create turbulence and shifting flow. I don't mind playing a little more if it gets the job done.

Thanks for the replies... I appreciate the help.
 
Edwardw771

Edwardw771

NJRC Member
One major pro for Vortech is that Ice Cap services them here in NJ. If you have issue with it they will fix it.
As of now anyway.
 
D

Demo

tgee, now that you mention it, I also read about the noise issue, but I also thought it sounded like isolated users not having the pump properly installed. The rust was a new one for me, but glad to hear it's being resolved.

Since the controller allows the flow to be reduced, I'm sure I can get it down to about 50X tank volume which is about what I have right now. When I upgrade the tank, then they can run full steam.
 
Hawkeye

Hawkeye

I can't speak to the vortechs - never owned one. Here are my opinions on the tunze streams (not nano).

On the downside:
They are bulky. / The holder is terrible. /They are pricey.

On the plus-side:
Service is top notch. / The flow and energy efficiency is superb.

Some other factoids that probably only interest me...

1) if you get a stream, get a magnet to hold it. It's more money I know but the magnets are FAR better than the cheap plastic thingys.
2) They are overhauling the streams in fall 2008. The 6105 (replacing the 01) will come out in oct/nov 08.

For more info on the new design - see my earlier post here

As an aside - you may still want to check around with the njrc discount and see if our sponsors won't match or beat that price.
 
T

tgee

Thanks for the link, Phil.

Decisions, decisions. Right now I'm leaning towards the Vortechs (subject to change without notice), mostly because of the smaller size.
 
D

Demo

Thanks Bob, I've seen it before, but it was definately worth seeing again. I'm going to shoot for a little less flow than that, or divorce will be in the future.

Rob
 
Hawkeye

Hawkeye

well that beats a tunze - you need a tunze wavebox (6212) to replicate that kind of wave action, and the 6212 is designed for larger (six foot) long tanks - not a 90 gallon.

My only caution on what I saw on the vortech video link above was I did not see an overflow box, wondering how that would impacted if you master/slaved the pumps like that.

Finally - supposedly - when you create waves like that you are messing around with the physics of the tank and reduce the overall lifespan (e.g. instead of 20 years - the tank will last 17 years). This is per tunze and the use of their wavebox (which in effect does the same thing).
 
jimroth

jimroth

I agree with what Phil said about wavemaking. I was just reading in a book that wavemaking will make you sump levels go up and down driving your ATO system crazy.
 
T

tgee

Well, I decided to take advantage of the one-day sale at Allquatics and ordered 2 Vortechs. Their regular price is just a tiny bit more than the usual $420 available at most online retailers, but a 15% discount is awesome.
 
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