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How do you deal with ICH.....

thirty5

thirty5

I lost a Naso due to ICH...

Now what to do with the rest of the livestock...

I was able to net out the Goby (which may have been the introducer of ICH) please no response about QT'n, i know better I messed up!
I then was able to catch the male anthias with a hook and line..

Problem is that I cannot get out the 2 female anthias! I actually hooked one of them, but the damn line came off the hook. Now they wont go near it....

They Anthias have shown ZERO signs of ICH! Here is the question, if the fish can fight off the ICH will that cause the ICH to not be able to spawn. I have a good friend who has been in the fish business for 35 years. He said that as long as the animal is not showing signs then the fish is not hosting and then the ICH cannot survive.

Right now tearing the tank apart to get the fish out is not an option (because I don't want to do it).

I also have a bottle trap in the tank, but they won't go near it anyway.

What are your thoughts on this????
 
Hawkeye

Hawkeye

Ugh anthony that's tough - sorry to hear the loss.

I think your choices are limited to:

Attempt to remove the remaining fish, you want to get the tank empty (fallow) and wait 6~8 weeks.
OR
Heavily feed (some swear by garlic), keep changing water and hope that the fish will eventually be able to withstand the ich.

Scientifically the first option makes the most sense since no fish means absolutely zero possibility of the ich living. You have to be careful not to use a net in the display tank during the fallow period and using it in the hospital tank (contaminating everything).

Anecdotally I have seen enough posts from people to believe that maybe you could do it with fish in the tank. Anthias tend to be swimming in the water column and perhaps when the ich spores hatch (closed to the sandbed) they are not able to quickly latch on. Then again maybe they are in the anthia gills and you just don't see em. So i guess what I am saying is that this MAY work - but there is no science behind it.

Good luck...oh and make sure it is ich. I believe there is another common disease that looks similar but is not ich.
 
thirty5

thirty5

i know going Fallow is really the only way to guarantee that they are gone.

But the question is this and I cannot find an answer!

The Anthias are showing NO signs of infection. You would think that if they were infected they would show something, if in the gills you would think that they would show some breathing issue. But none, and believe me I stare at them all the time. So if they are not infected I would assume the the ICH would die off since they need the fish to host on. Or are the ICH hosting but not having an effect on the fish! IDK that is the million dollar question.

I also thought about the idea of something else (that looks like ich). It was not velvet that I think I can rule out. The Naso actually died pretty quick from first sign, so either it got something other than ICH, or the ICH was so infested in the tank that the fish just got slammed with it.

The addition of the non-QT fish was not there that long, so it was not like there was much time for the ICH to reproduce in the tank.

I am at a loss!
 
NikkiT

NikkiT

Hi Anthony,
When ICH is visible to the naked eye, it is because the parasite is present in our tanks, on our fish, in the cystic phase, in such a volume that we, for lack of a better term, "notice" it.
If you had velvet in your tank, in all likelihood your other fish would be sick as well. velvet is pretty virulent.
With ICH, many of us (including Mike and me) have it in our systems- it "flares up" for us if we 1) attempt to overstock or 2) underfeed, and thus stress, our fish. We see a few spots on one or two fish, address the issue, and it "goes away" (stops being visible) after a short period. In my opinion, I would think that the naso had something else going on that weakened it, and made it susceptible to ICH. The only times I have lost a fish to ICH, I have had infestations that have resulted in the majority of my fish showing signs of a serious ICH outbreak.

I (personally) see ICH as a symptom that a) something is wrong with my tank or b) something is wrong with a particular fish that has compromised its health to such a degree that it is susceptible to ICH. That said, I am afraid that I am pretty sure that even though not a fish in my 57g has ICH, that the parasite is nonetheless in my tank. . . So yes, it is more than possible (unfortunately) to have the parasite in your tank, without seeing it.
 
malulu

malulu

NJRC Member
thirty5 said:
So a fish can host the parasite without showing any symptoms?
Click to expand...

yes, and they may started to shows when they got stress (like temperature suddenly went up...etc.)

like Phil said, feed them with Garlic helped...
[edit] i chopped garlic into small chunks, them squeeze them in between two spoons stacking up each other... with the garlic juice and garlic bits to mix with flake foods... then feed to the fishes.

if possible, you may want to get "cleaner shrimp" and/or "neon goby" too...
and when the fish see them, they will swim next to them and let them clean (eat) the Ich off their body...

"cleaner shrimp" is easy to find
p-78348-Scarlet-Skunk-Clea.jpg


neon goby is not too common to find (you can try to call Ocean Galary II, they have it from time to time)
p-80275-neon-blue-goby.jpg


NOTE: some use cleaner wrasse (they look ALIKE to neon goby, but with sharper nose, and prettier tail), problem is, once they clean all the ich they may starve as they normally not eat normal food (neon goby does eat any foods)
0304101-124.jpg


good luck.
 
falconut

falconut

NJRC Member
I used Metronidazole years ago and it seamed to help, because I never saw it since. I had an angel that looked fine in QT, but right after going into my DT had white dots pop up. I couldn't get her out, so I sprinkled this on wet food and let sit for a few minutes then fed. After a week or so (it was a while ago) it was gone and didn't come back. I had loads of corals and inverts that had no issues. But, I didn't treat my water, I just fed it.
 
S

SHLUZER

I use commercial garlic extract, couple drops with every feeding, this also stimulates feeding instincts.
Also have cleaner shrimps, which did not help much when one of the fishes was really sick.
I believe someone suggested raising the temprerature of the tank somewhat (which is limited due to SPS there).
So, the most practical solution - feed fish well, add garlic with food, let the sick fish die, keep water parameters in check.
Good luck.
 
NyteGTI

NyteGTI

I tried herbal treatments like rid ich or ich attack(forget the name) & they were completely useless. the ich looked like it went away & then the following day it was all over & killed the coral beauty. the only true 100% cure is to QT & treat the fish you have(whether they're showing signs or not) & keep the tank fallow for 6+ weeks. or risk that the anthias develop immunity but spread it to a future purchases & start this all over again. imo i'd nip it in the butt now. Also there have been studies on the garlic theory(I wish I could find the info, I'll look when I'm home tonight) that suggest it's pretty much a placebo for us, it won't stop ich.
 
Hawkeye

Hawkeye

Cleaner shrimp help but are useless if the ich is in the gills or in the egg/swimming stage. I'm not sure if true or not but I also read that sometimes the cleaners just cause the ich to burrow deeper into the fish (not helping, but makes it look to us like it cleared up).

In the wild it makes sense in that the fish get cleaned and then move on and have a healthy constitution etc and are able to move away from the "area" where the infestation is. But unfortunately in our closed boxes, the ich eggs hatch and the fish have nowhere to get away...
 
thirty5

thirty5

Well hate to say, that I may have mis-diagnoes the problem in my tank :(

I only have 1 fish left in the tank (female anthias)... My daughter just called me over to look at it. When it is under blue lights there is a whitish sheen over the fish long with some spots on the face. I am kinda thinking velvet now :(.....

I am not a happy camper :(
 
thirty5

thirty5

the other female anthias just disappeared, I thought that it jumped but i think that it is def MV. I had removed 2 other fish from the tank and put them in copper thinking it was ICH, and they are doing fine in the hospital tank... I just went and looked at them and they seem to be doing fine!
 
thirty5

thirty5

I just snapped a few pics of the fish. I know that they are not the best, lights are not bright now and it would not stay still... But you can see that something does not look right. The fish is not showing any symptoms other than the sheen...

_MG_0078.jpg

_MG_0074.jpg

_MG_0073.jpg

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