Sort of an easy “Emergency” battery back-up measure if you have a vortech

[fatoldsun]

Given all the problems that have come up in the last 2 weeks (plus today's storm and this winter's projections) and given the fact that I can’t get a coral to grow to save my life (so I have nothing really to contribute in the recovery efforts of those who have lost stuff) I thought I’d add what ever $0.02 I could offer. I believe I found a way to make a backup that will cover you for 24-36 hours with little more than a $2 cable from EcoTech and any 12V car battery…

Over the summer I bought a used (older model) EcoTech battery backup. It was one of the “IceCap” models. Ecotech recalled these or more specifically, the cable that goes between the battery pack and the unit’s controller. The result of the recall was to issue a simple replacement cable with an in-line fuse. EcoTech sells them for under $5.oo and sends them with reduced cost shipping so really I think 1 cable will be under $5 total. (note if you want to make multiple emergency back-ups running off a single battery you can but you need multiple cables). That was lesson 1– basically there is a good supply of these cables and they take all of the mystery out of trying to DIY a battery back-up. The next thing I learned was that there is nothing (I mean NOTHING) to my backup other than a white metal case, 4 rivets and a 12V battery. In the case of what they gave you in the IceCap version it was an 18.0 Amp hour battery. Lesson 2 – any car battery with a charge should do – the bigger the battery the longer your DC powered pumps will run. Essentially (as I understand it) the brick that sits between the AC power source and the controller is a transformer – just like any PC/computer monitor, printer, etc... It simply converts from AC to DC and so a 12 volt DC battery requires no conversion, nothing fancy. All you need is a way to get the power from the battery to the controller. This cable does that for you. No searching in Radio Shack for the correct size plug

Ok, so bottom line – get yourself one (or a bunch of cables) and cut off one plug end (preferably the one with more wire after the fuse) and get some terminal but-connectors so you can hook the cable up to a battery. Now the tricky part may be getting the polarity right so you may have to do some guessing using the inline fuse as a clue (should be coming off the positive side) - check this before you use it – I got lucky but I don’t want anyone frying their controller and blaming me

Presto – a battery back up. Now getting your wife to let you pull her battery to run your pump until the power comes back on – that’s on you. On the bright side, you can pop the dead battery back in once it’s used up and jump start the car letting it run for about 30 minutes to recharge the battery off the car's alternator. I’m pretty sure that’s bad for a battery but these are desperate times. Or you could keep a spare battery (maybe you are lucky enough to have one for a boat or just a spare cheap battery) on a trickle charger and pull it out if/when needed. I think if I had the option of a fish room I would do one on a battery minder trickle charger and leave it hooked up instead of the EcoTeck option. I guess if you have their lights this would work on those too

I’m not sure why a larger version of the backup isn’t sold – I guess just weight and how unsightly it would be but in a jam, this should cover you. Now if someone can tell me how to run my heater off DC I wouldn’t be worried about any of these storms. I don't want EcoTech making a DC heater that costs $200 so I'll try to come up with something else there

Hope this helps someone.

here’s a link to the DIY thread with pics and such on RC - if that’s permissible here

 

[TanksNStuff]

Good to know if my VorTech craps out on me. Thanks Dave.

I happen to have (2) x 6v batteries at work (they're 4.5 amps each). Do you think I could daisy chain them to get a total of 12v? I'm guessing it probably won't be as powerful... but I could probably still get limited use out of them. Probably better than nothing anyway.

 

[dan_k]

Hey Dave that is a great idea I have a option for your heater
Since you already have a battery handy buy a power inverter black and decker makes a good one I have a 500watt that runs a drill and works great my inverter came with 2 ways to hook it up one cigarette lighter or gator clips hooks right up to the battery + and - it should heat for a good amount of time

 

[fatoldsun]

Good to know if my VorTech craps out on me. Thanks Dave.

I happen to have (2) x 6v batteries at work (they're 4.5 amps each). Do you think I could daisy chain them to get a total of 12v? I'm guessing it probably won't be as powerful... but I could probably still get limited use out of them. Probably better than nothing anyway.

perhaps someone smarter than me could weigh in on this George. My thought is any DC power source would suffice but the voltage may play into it in a way that goes beyond my VERY infantile understanding….

Hey Dave that is a great idea I have a option for your heater
Since you already have a battery handy buy a power inverter black and decker makes a good one I have a 500watt that runs a drill and works great my inverter came with 2 ways to hook it up one cigarette lighter or gator clips hooks right up to the battery + and - it should heat for a good amount of time

Good idea Dan, thanks. I have an inverter for my kid's nebulizer for when we are on trips and want to put her right to bed when we get home. I guess I always assumed that they would eat the power up pretty quickly without the car running to keep it charged - I thought the VorTechs were different since they are designed to run on DC. I guess in a jam I can give it a shot. I with I had $10k for a sick whole house LP option - then again if I had $10k I'd have a bigger tank and setup and the $10k would be gone before any generator was installed. Or a solar system with a battery backup - how much more than $10k out of pocket woudl that be??? Ok I'm gonna get myself in trouble - back to the inverter....

 

[magic]

Dave

Thanks, I just ordered the battery. My Vortech Battery Backup died after 5 minutes when Sandy took out the power. It worked for Irene and this time it just crapped out no warning. I also ordered another Vortech Backup so I'll have a lot of backup power(I'm pretty sure you can daisy chain them).

Bob

 

[jpelzer]

I've got 5x 200AH batteries on their way to me... I also ordered a 2000w inverter that automatically switches to recharge the batteries when power is restored. That should run 500w average for about 24 hours, enough to power the return pump, refrigerator, and boiler until I can get a 200' power cable run over to my neighbor's generator.

You might want to get an actual battery charger for your setup, 12v batteries will recharge better an last longer if you do.

Your note made me think that maybe I should run some 12v from the battery bank over to some Vortechs.

 

[redfishbluefish]

Good to know if my VorTech craps out on me. Thanks Dave.

I happen to have (2) x 6v batteries at work (they're 4.5 amps each). Do you think I could daisy chain them to get a total of 12v?

If you "daisy chain" them is a series circuit, volts are additive, so yes, you will have 12 volts. A series circuit of batteries is like two D size batteries in a column flashlight.....positive to negative ends. That is the positive pole of one battery is attached to the negative pole of the other battery. With voltage being additive in a series circuit, you will now have the 12 volts. If you hook them up in a parallel circuit (positive to positive and negative to negative), voltage in not additive.....you would still only have six volts.

Hope my description is clear. If not, let me know and I'll draw a picture.

 

[fatoldsun]

If you "daisy chain" them is a series circuit, volts are additive, so yes, you will have 12 volts. A series circuit of batteries is like two D size batteries in a column flashlight.....positive to negative ends. That is the positive pole of one battery is attached to the negative pole of the other battery. With voltage being additive in a series circuit, you will now have the 12 volts. If you hook them up in a parallel circuit (positive to positive and negative to negative), voltage in not additive.....you would still only have six volts.

Hope my description is clear. If not, let me know and I'll draw a picture.

Paul:
Just curious, would parallel boost the amps with the volts constant at 6? And if the pumps run on DC would it matter if you had 6V or 12V?

for the next lesson can you explain forward voltage? It comes up a lot on the LED build threads but I'm not sure I get the concept.

 

[redfishbluefish]

Dave, you make it sound like I know what I’m talking about!

First let’s take a step back. Car batteries are DC….as are the batteries George has. My comment about connecting two 6 volt batteries together was to get to the same voltage you mentioned in your power source for the Vortechs. I would think that the voltage is more critical to this thing powering the pumps….current capacity (amps), isn’t as critical to this thing working….although the more current capacity you have, the better off you would be.

Now to your questions:

Simply put, batteries in series have additive voltage, while current capacity remains the same. With batteries in parallel, voltage remains the same while current capacity is additive.


Diode forward voltage is the voltage drop when current passes through a diode….all diodes do this. HERE’s a more detailed description.

 

[TanksNStuff]

Thanks for the excellent explanations Paul!

 

[ecam]

This sounds to techy for me.... i should've paid more attention in science class... LOL



Paul, your depth of knowledge doesnt end does it... Chemist, Electrcian, LOL

 

[Ryeguyy84]

before the storm I went to radio shack and bought a 12V 12AH battery with some wire, fuse and a model H plug. I charged the battery with my battery tender wired up and plugged into my MP10. it lasted a full 3 days for $60. I'm going to pick up a 34AH battery for the next time. I think it would last close to 8 days.

 

[fatoldsun]

Thanks Paul, knew I could count on you for a solid explanation (or source)

Rye - great that it worked out for you. I wish I had the confidence to just make the backup - i really thought there was some mystery to it - some circuitry to go with the fancy case but there is literally nothing to it but a battery and a wire.

 

[Ryeguyy84]

yeah normally I'm not the wire it up yourself kind of guy but I knew the power was going out so I needed something. I was worried I was going to somehow fry my vortech or kill myself with toxic battery fumes but it all worked out haha

 

[jpelzer]

Here's what 800 pounds of batteries look like (5x 200AH, 12V):

 

[Ryeguyy84]

Looks like the batteries we have at work (construction). Can you run/charge those indoors? Are they sealed?

Also what in the world are you powering?

 

[jpelzer]

Yep, they are sealed. I have an eight circuit transfer switch that can take battery or generator input during a failure. It uses the battery backup until the generator kicks in. It can also manage load, so for instance I might not run the refrigerator on UPS power, but I would run the boiler. 1000Ah should run about 500w of load for 24 hours, enough time for me to get home or have the neighbor run cable to his generator.

 

[Edwardw771]

How much was that

 

[jpelzer]

Not cheap, but I don't have a place to site a hard-wired generator, so I needed something to handle most outages that would buy me time to get home or contact a neighbor:

2000w power inverter, hard-wired, recharger: $600
http://amzn.com/B00006HNY1
10-circuit transfer switch: $450
http://amzn.com/B000XQGNFC
5x 200Ah 12v batteries: $1750
Assorted cables and connectors: $200

So about $3000 all in. I'm doing the install myself.

 

[TanksNStuff]

Not cheap, but I don't have a place to site a hard-wired generator, so I needed something to handle most outages that would buy me time to get home or contact a neighbor:

2000w power inverter, hard-wired, recharger: $600
http://amzn.com/B00006HNY1
10-circuit transfer switch: $450
http://amzn.com/B000XQGNFC
5x 200Ah 12v batteries: $1750
Assorted cables and connectors: $200

So about $3000 all in. I'm doing the install myself.

Ouch! It would probably be cheaper to just buy a whole new tank and re-stock it if a power outage crashed it.